Reels

Tiptopperoo

Tiptopperoo

CCRx Supporter
*Disclaimer* This will touch on another topic - Redundant Buoyancy - which will be dealt with in another topic.

I'm heading off to do MOD2&3 in Indonesia in a weeks time (I'm there for 5wks with MOD3 being if both myself and the instructor are happy after diving together every day for month). And I've got myself a 122m Halcyon Pathfinder Reel to use in case of wing failure at depth. Now I can deploy my DMSB with a finger reel no dramas. Been doing it for years, but I've only ever used a reel once. And it was a crappy reel, and I stuffed it up.

So now that I have a good reel, can anyone give me a good step by step guide to deploying using a big reel?
 
- disattach reel and DSMB from yourself
- make sure DSMB is attached to reel line
- unfold DSMB
- back off lock nut on reel keeping finger on spool to keep line tension and stop it unwinding and keep it there.
- hold DSMB strap with spare finger on reel hand
- squirt gas in DSMB with crack bottle / suit feed / whatever
- let go of DSMB (very important)
- slow spool with your finger or palm of hand as it pays out to stop it birdsnesting.
- wind in string

that should cover it.

mike

PS if using a double ender to attach the reel make sure you attach the point of the clip down into the handle hole not up through the hole or you will lose the reel.
 
Thanks Mike,

Most of them were on my list (except let go of SMB, I'll add that right now) I was after some nuances.

ie. when inflating with my finger spool, I hold my spool and bag in my right hand, and my LP inflator in my left, I then attach the LP inflator on the LP nipple on the bag, but don't start inflating just yet. I then switch the bag into the left hand with the LP inflator, hold both hands out infront and start gas flowing into the bag. When I'm happy I let go of the bag from L) hand and hang on to the spool with R) hand.

So I'm wondering what hands people use for doing what when, during reel deployment. Although the more I think about it, I'll be shooting from that deep that a sparrow farts worth of gas should have me a rather erect SMB on the surface, even when shooting my BFO Halcyon one.
 
If you use a bag for redundant buoyancy use one with a dump valve and don't put it on a line.

When putting a bag up from depth we do it as a team - one inflates, one runs the reel.
 
Tiptopperoo said:
Thanks Mike,

Most of them were on my list (except let go of SMB, I'll add that right now) I was after some nuances.

ie. when inflating with my finger spool, I hold my spool and bag in my right hand, and my LP inflator in my left, I then attach the LP inflator on the LP nipple on the bag, but don't start inflating just yet. I then switch the bag into the left hand with the LP inflator, hold both hands out infront and start gas flowing into the bag. When I'm happy I let go of the bag from L) hand and hang on to the spool with R) hand.

So I'm wondering what hands people use for doing what when, during reel deployment. Although the more I think about it, I'll be shooting from that deep that a sparrow farts worth of gas should have me a rather erect SMB on the surface, even when shooting my BFO Halcyon one.
Click to expand...

sorry, couldn't resist. slow day at the office.

I prep the reel to free spool, then hold the reel and bag in the left hand while putting in gas with the right hand, just enough that I can feel it starting to tug. at that point I keep a hold of the reel in the left hand with a finger on the spool to slow it and then take the buoy in my right hand hold it clear and let it go. I then slow the spool rotation with my right hand to maintain tension in the line as it feeds out.
As you say you don't need much gas at depth for a full erection on the surface.
 
I use a crack bottle DSMB.

I like to squirt just enough gas into the bag to get it to stand up without becoming very buoyant then stop. I then check that everything looks good, ratched loosed, check if my buddy is ready etc. Then give it another squirt closing the valve before letting go.
 
I do it all different than most people, but it works very very well for me and I have no desire to do it differently.

When I am ready to shoot my bag, I will dump some of my wing gas and add plenty of dil to the loop to make up for the lose of buoyancy. I then pull my reel and bag out, hook them together and let the reel hang by the bottom of the bag. I raise the bag over my head and let gas escape from around my lips into the bottom of the bag. My buoyancy won't change with the bags inflation and I can hold the bag as long as I need to while waiting for others or making sure that the line is free before letting go.

Before I release the bag, I will wrap my finger around my wing inflation button. I push the inflate button at the same time I release the bag. I establish neutral buoyancy and listen to my mp3 player.

I realize that my method is thinking a little outside the box. Don't knock it until you have tried it though.
 
DSix36 said:
I do it all different than most people, but it works very very well for me and I have no desire to do it differently.

When I am ready to shoot my bag, I will dump some of my wing gas and add plenty of dil to the loop to make up for the lose of buoyancy. I then pull my reel and bag out, hook them together and let the reel hang by the bottom of the bag. I raise the bag over my head and let gas escape from around my lips into the bottom of the bag. My buoyancy won't change with the bags inflation and I can hold the bag as long as I need to while waiting for others or making sure that the line is free before letting go.

Before I release the bag, I will wrap my finger around my wing inflation button. I push the inflate button at the same time I release the bag. I establish neutral buoyancy and listen to my mp3 player.

I realize that my method is thinking a little outside the box. Don't knock it until you have tried it though.
Click to expand...

Nice, and I am not knocking it but as a cold water diver, I can't remember the last time I had air in my wing while underwater.

I find a small reel easer to handle, remember I have dry gloves and liners on, than a spool. I am not sure about this, but it seems to me that there is a limit to how deep a bag should be blown?



Peter
 
I use a kent tooling (love that one) with an APDiving SMB with crack bottle,which is loved by the skipper due to the size, and bungees as primary (costs seconds to grab and deploy) and a custom divers with a halcyon as spare for which I have to use my inflator hose on my bailout (does cost me a bit more time, but I can still do it under a minute). Don't solve a problem underwater by unknotting a reel (did it once and got me and my buddy in trouble). That's also why I use the bungees now. The scubapro reel on my emergency by the way is crap and will be replaced with another kent tooling one with crack bottle soon.
Hope that my pictures help you a bit.

And I have an APDiving liftbag in case of another unforeseen situation (just have that on my bailout or scooter).
P1020101_30.jpg

P1020102_30.jpg
 
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Olaf Bontes said:
I use a kent tooling (love that one) with an APDiving SMB with crack bottle,which is loved by the skipper due to the size, and bungees as primary (costs seconds to grab and deploy) and a custom divers with a halcyon as spare for which I have to use my inflator hose on my bailout (does cost me a bit more time, but I can still do it under a minute). Don't solve a problem underwater by unknotting a reel (did it once and got me and my buddy in trouble). That's also why I use the bungees now. The scubapro reel on my emergency by the way is crap and will be replaced with another kent tooling one with crack bottle soon.
Hope that my pictures help you a bit.

And I have an APDiving liftbag in case of another unforeseen situation (just have that on my bailout or scooter).
View attachment 2914

View attachment 2915
Click to expand...

Where do you keep all that?

Peter
 
Olaf Bontes said:
I use a kent tooling (love that one) with an APDiving SMB with crack bottle,which is loved by the skipper due to the size, and bungees as primary (costs seconds to grab and deploy) and a custom divers with a halcyon as spare for which I have to use my inflator hose on my bailout (does cost me a bit more time, but I can still do it under a minute). Don't solve a problem underwater by unknotting a reel (did it once and got me and my buddy in trouble). That's also why I use the bungees now. The scubapro reel on my emergency by the way is crap and will be replaced with another kent tooling one with crack bottle soon.
Hope that my pictures help you a bit.

And I have an APDiving liftbag in case of another unforeseen situation (just have that on my bailout or scooter).
View attachment 2914

View attachment 2915
Click to expand...



I bought the same system you have only used it once so far , I found this easy to deploy although it was shallow..
Great for a 2nd dive I just use my BO tank to refill takes seconds to fill, I hook it onto my L/hand D-ring, the only thing I don't like is it's a little heavy.
 
Tiptopperoo said:
I've got myself a 122m Halcyon Pathfinder Reel to use in case of wing failure at depth.
Click to expand...

Btw. If your wing fails you won't need the reel. There is no way in the world that you'll be able to pull yourself up by sending the smb up and trying ascend by pulling the rope.

You'll need to inflate and release gas from the smb as you go up.

D



Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
 
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zirk said:
Hmm interesting. How is this small co2 cartridge configured with the lift bag?
Click to expand...

I make these, we use a similar mechanism that you might find on a life jacket, to fire the DSMB you just pull the cord and the buoy flies off to the surface. Generally they are smaller than a full DSMB and use 16gram cartridges (same as bicycle tyre inflators, sodastreams, BB guns etc) but we make a bigger one that uses 38gram cartridges that as 5ft+ but they get expensive to use every dive with replacing the cartridges.
Originally these where designed as backups so you don't fire them often.

With a regular DSMB I usually dump the wing into it first, the buoyancy exchange keeps the depth constant rather than the common upward drift you see. On OC I fill the bag off the exhaled bubbles (none of that LP inflator faff) on CC I used a crack bottle (0.1ltr air cylinder filed on a full size OC tank) or CO2 blob.
 
dmainou said:
Btw. If your wing fails you won't need the reel. There is no way in the world that you'll be able to pull yourself up by sending the smb up and trying ascend by pulling the rope.

You'll need to inflate and release gas from the smb as you go up."


Ok, bit of lateral thinking, but you can use an smb as a buoyancy aid. Forget the reel....

(NOTE: This is "fun" drill (especially if bored!). Deepest I have used this is 20m in a quarry and it worked fine).

For example pick a depth, say 10m -> 6m......partially inflate smb (just enough that it is not going to rocket up, so will be perhaps under 1/3 full.

Turn it upside down, so all air goes to valve and the pull dump is easily accessible on the top. Now "choke" the smb with your hand, so air is now trapped in the "valve end" and cannot go to the other end...

The fun bit......now hold like a "bagpipe" / or place under armpit - a couple of fin kicks and you are slowly moving up.....(You do look a litlle like Dr Evil stroking his cat)

Use the toggle dump on smb to vent and it is quite easy to control your ascent / hold a stop. Add a couple of fin kicks when you want to move up and repeat.....

However, if you let too much air out, you will need to fin a bit more until it starts to naturally expand....

Oh, and it is a steep learning curve.....it takes a bit of practice not to overfill, otherwise you have to let go....so bring a few "spares" on the dive!
Click to expand...
 
zirk said:
Hmm interesting. How is this small co2 cartridge configured with the lift bag?
Click to expand...


Most folks don't use C02, there is a depth (cannot remember what it is) where C02 will no longer expand from it's compressed liquid state to a gas... (someone else help out here with the depth please?). Ben, do you know?


Crack bottles are small alumimum bottles that are filled by connecting them to a standard tank and equalizing. Then they are removed and attached to the SMB. You "crack" the valve to inflate them.

These are standard kit, or ought to be standard kit for rebreather divers.


Dave


.
 
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there is a depth (cannot remember what it is) where C02 will no longer expand from it's compressed liquid state to a gas... (someone else help out here with the depth please?)
Click to expand...

Wikipedia says the vapor pressure of CO2 at 0C is about 35 bar. 40 (ish) bar at 5C. If you're deeper than that it'll stay liquid. I'd imagine if you're deep enough, it's not going to expand too fast. Another problem, like Ben said, is a 16g cartridge, as far as I can tell, is only 8L on the surface.

Ok, bit of lateral thinking, but you can use an smb as a buoyancy aid.
Click to expand...

Another way to do that is to use an SMB that can be clipped top to bottom. Clip then just rotate it so the dump is at the top, and hold it at the bottom. With a bit of line and a double-ender, you can even use this to carry stuff without filling your wing - and the associated problem you should you let go.

Cheers,

Matthieu
 
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