rEvo vs JJ CCR (or others) in a cave

[Engelen D]

Quote: (Originally Posted by jcook)

Hmm, didn't know you served in combat Dave.

Ah, well that's all and good if you don't want to believe me about the WOB for either unit, but you can look at the test of WOB in joules that are published for either unit. I believe the JJ has better WOB than even my old Boris, 1.57 J or something close. Too bad rEvo's aren't 3rd party tested for anything...... Plus in proper cave trim, the rEvo sucks. I have experienced it and I hear my friends complain about it on their rEvo's. They swim like wreck divers in the cave and I have to come up and adjust them underwater.

As for the CE problems, just take a look on RBW at Paul (guy who makes the rEvo) trying to cover his ass with basic questions from people about his CE testing and the standards he is using.

Pffff.....I personally don't give a shit what people think causse it's only good that everybody has a different opinion / choice.
There are some remarks on the rEvo wich I can understand that they could be a drawback for some people.
Reading your post's on the other hand give's me the impression that you don't have a problem with the rEvo but only a hughe problem with the builder, Mr.Raymakers P., himself.
There seems to be a lot of frustration in your postings, I wonder what Paul did ( or did not?) to piss you off like this ! ;-)
In a way it''s a pity cause you had some good points in different postings ( not towards rEvo)
In the mean time I will have fun and keep learning with my toy.
Have fun and dive safe ;-)


Sent from my rEvodream using Tapatalk

[DSix36]

Quote: (Originally Posted by engelen d)

pffff.....i personally don't give a shit what people think causse it's only good that everybody has a different opinion / choice.
There are some remarks on the revo wich i can understand that they could be a drawback for some people.
Reading your post's on the other hand give's me the impression that you don't have a problem with the revo but only a hughe problem with the builder, mr.raymakers p., himself.
There seems to be a lot of frustration in your postings, i wonder what paul did ( or did not?) to piss you off like this ! ;-)
in a way it''s a pity cause you had some good points in different postings ( not towards revo)
in the mean time i will have fun and keep learning with my toy.
Have fun and dive safe ;-)


sent from my revodream using tapatalk

+1

[Mark Chase]

Quote: (Originally Posted by dmainou)

Hi guys,

Met a cave diver that dives a rEvo and was bragging about how much better the rEvo is inside a cave than a JJ.

I'd like your opinion about the veracity of his claims as I'm conscious of his animosity towards the local JJ dealer and acquaintance with the local rEvo shop


I haven't come across that many rEvos and I'm not a cave diver.

Amongst many other things he said that he could take the rEvo into tighter spots. Does the shape of the cans makes a big difference on a regular basis?

I've heard that the rEvo has little flood recovery so....

Anyway, since I'm not a cave diver, I'm happy to listen to more educated people than me.

D

I had a rEvo Hybrid and I sold it to pay for my JJ

I also dive caves


The rEvo is by far and away the smallest profile of any of the main CCR choices or any twinset above twin 7s and will enable you to get into the smallest possible non side mount opening.

There are however several down sides which would make me chose the JJ.

1: Water tolerance

2: Cells are exposed so a flood can trash the cells

3: Hud doesn't show actual cell readings for each individual cell so when scootering you still need to regularly check the hand set

4: Mini was too heavy for neutral buoyancy in a wet suit or dry laminate with just a base layer

5: Lots of hose connections hidden inside the SS back box that you cant test properly pre dive unless you take out the 1000 something screws that hold the cover on.

6: Position of 02 manual add is not ideal but you can get a front mounted 02 add

7. Diluent button can get sticky and needs looking after

8: ADV is rubbish, as it either has too light a cracking pressure and you end up struggling to maintain minimum loop or its rock hard and running SCR would be a nightmare.

9: No BOV but thats a personal choice thing and the JJ one isn't very good do you still have to sell it and buy a golum

10: Not as easy to travel with as a JJ


On the + side

The scrubber and extended scrubber is fantastic

It trims out beautifully if in a suitably buoyant suit

Its so easy to clean

Its so easy to work on the cells and ADV

Its very easy to modify and put secondary displays on.


As for the JJ

Bad Points

Exposed counterlngs more easily damaged

T Piece design on loop makes head movement / visual range smaller than on rEvo

Standard BOV is poor as an OC reg and only suitable for non C02 bailout events IMHO

Batteries a sod to get at

Hose routing a bit of a faf

Very hard to work on the head as its all potted and therefore hard to add on displays.

Aside from that its a great unit which I haven't had to do any mods on except change the BOV for a Golum Shrimp.


ATB

Mark

[Chriso]

Quote: (Originally Posted by jcook)

Hmm, didn't know you served in combat Dave.

Ah, well that's all and good if you don't want to believe me about the WOB for either unit, but you can look at the test of WOB in joules that are published for either unit. I believe the JJ has better WOB than even my old Boris, 1.57 J or something close. Too bad rEvo's aren't 3rd party tested for anything...... Plus in proper cave trim, the rEvo sucks. I have experienced it and I hear my friends complain about it on their rEvo's. They swim like wreck divers in the cave and I have to come up and adjust them underwater.

I guess that's why Dave and Sandy choose the rEvo for 200m, 8 hour dives on the wrecks out of Perth And 200m 10+ hour cave dives in the Pearce Resurgence in NZ....

Your friends sound like they should of got more training if they can't even trim out a rEvo, nothing easier...

Cheers
Chriso

[Raptor^]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dave Sutton)

With that said I am packing both the rEvo and the JJ later today onto the boat and I can probably wrangle up a side by side photo of their thickness.

Did you get a chance to photograph these two units together? Would be nice to see some good size photos of the rEvo and the JJ side by side, back to back and front to front from different angles including from above.

[dmainou]

I think Dave has bigger issues right now. As, in his shop and home are under mud.


D

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

[paulraymaekers]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Engelen D)

Pffff.....I personally don't give a shit what people think causse it's only good that everybody has a different opinion / choice.
There are some remarks on the rEvo wich I can understand that they could be a drawback for some people.
Reading your post's on the other hand give's me the impression that you don't have a problem with the rEvo but only a hughe problem with the builder, Mr.Raymakers P., himself.
There seems to be a lot of frustration in your postings, I wonder what Paul did ( or did not?) to piss you off like this ! ;-)
In a way it''s a pity cause you had some good points in different postings ( not towards rEvo)
In the mean time I will have fun and keep learning with my toy.
Have fun and dive safe ;-)


Sent from my rEvodream using Tapatalk

+

some people just post lies because they don't like me... but that's the world hé it has always been that way, and it will stay that way
some people shoot first, and then think, well...
some people are not smart enough to understand rebreather fundamentals, so why spend the time...
some people don't like me because I point them to the nonsens they post on internet forums... ok then, so be it

- no third party testing? all our CE tests were done at the ANSTI lab in Southampton (it's not because we have our own lab, that the CE testing is not done in an independant lab)

com'on..

[paulraymaekers]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

......


ATB

Mark

Hi Mark, just for your info

- we now make all units with only front mounted addition (if you want)
- the micro FT seems to become a travel preferred unit
- the new rEvodream P can be set to 'modified smithers' for those that want to count and know the PPO2
- and of course no more tapping, just a simple straith forward push on the piezo to activate or to calibrate, automatic detection of 1 or 2 sensors, and some more features

paul

[JONT]

Quote: (Originally Posted by jcook)

I would go with a JJ, way better WOB, easier to breakdown for travel, use of any size tanks, etc. A lot of time and effort was put into the JJ to make it a great unit by rebreather divers who know what they are doing. My only thing that would keep me from buying the JJ is the scrubbers. I am not a fan of their little scrims on the radial scrubbers. Plus the JJ is truly CE, not just skirting around the CE standard.

I would stay away from the rEvo like the plague. I also almost bought one as my first rebreather, I actually was about to send the money to pre-order a rEvo III before they came out. Then I got to see one in person, that was it for me. It isn't made anywhere near as well made as the JJ, the cell placement sucks, build quality is crap, no flood recoverability, etc.

It is like buying a Jaguar or a BMW, one is beautifully made and sexy, the other is an engineer's wet dream that works.

FWIW I don't own either unit. I dive a Meg and have owned a few other units. I have about a dozen hours on a rEvo and zero on a JJ. I know they guy on the forum that has the precursor to the JJ though and it is a beautiful unit. You will hear people say the rEvo is the thinnest unit out there, but as a fact, it isn't.

Buddy you are on crack cocaine, my revo 3 has better WOB then ANY RB I own and you know what that number is, granted I spent a LOT of time perfecting it because of my poor posture but now when you get to cave country in a few days to dive with me YOU WILL BE ON MY REVO AT SOME POINT.

Give my best to your family and beautiful wife.

Jon

[JONT]

Quote: (Originally Posted by dmainou)

Hi guys,

Met a cave diver that dives a rEvo and was bragging about how much better the rEvo is inside a cave than a JJ.

I'd like your opinion about the veracity of his claims as I'm conscious of his animosity towards the local JJ dealer and acquaintance with the local rEvo shop


I haven't come across that many rEvos and I'm not a cave diver.

Amongst many other things he said that he could take the rEvo into tighter spots. Does the shape of the cans makes a big difference on a regular basis?

I've heard that the rEvo has little flood recovery so....

Anyway, since I'm not a cave diver, I'm happy to listen to more educated people than me.

D

I wouldn't listen to anyone that brags about his unit, the JJ is a fine unit and the developers did a fine job I had the opportunity to go through one in January 2012 and I like it a lot.

I'm a cave diver and dive a Revo 3 RMS and I couldn't be more satisfied, I've been in cave country Florida for 6 weeks now and will be here thru January 11 then back to NYC for 5 weeks then back down here.

I brought a Meg and Revo on this trip, I'm still a new REVO diver but in just under one year I've put over 200 hours on the unit and it gets better with every dive, I've said this a thousand times if I had to own one unit it would be a REVO 3 RMS.

Try every unit you can before you buy and make an informed decision.

Good luck,

Jon